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Author Topic: Chapter Sixteen: Professor Trelawney’s Prediction  (Read 1070 times)

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April 10, 2014, 07:11:45 PM

JaneMarple9

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Chapter Sixteen: Professor Trelawney’s Prediction
(Chap Summary by twiddlethosedials )


Fan Art by MikeyBooch


The thrill of winning the Quidditch Cup is fleeting, as soon exams are upon Hogwarts. The students turn teapots into tortoises, cheer each other into fits of giggles, try to keep flobberworms alive for an hour, and make their way through a D.A.D.A. obstacle course. Harry fakes his way through Trelawney’s exam until the end, when she goes into a kind of trance and makes what sounds like a real prediction. He’s all set to share this with Ron and Hermione when an owl from Hagrid stops him short. Buckbeak’s execution is set. They race down to his hut, find Scabbers there, and barely slip out the back door as the swish and thud of an axe sounds behind them.

A few questions to get you started:
1) What does Buckbeak’s appeal process tell you about justice in the wizarding world? Are there any parallels with Harry’s legal troubles in book five?

2) The focus is more on Trelawney’s prediction here than on Harry’s - but what do you think about his skills at Divination? Does he have a gift, or is it all coincidence?

3) Of all the places Scabbers could turn up, why Hagrid’s hut? (What I mean is - why didn’t Pettigrew just flit off to find Voldemort when he faked his ratty death before?)



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April 11, 2014, 09:25:24 PM
Reply #1

roonwit

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1) What does Buckbeak’s appeal process tell you about justice in the wizarding world? Are there any parallels with Harry’s legal troubles in book five?
The wizarding world seems fairly corrupt. Lucius Malfoy is able to influence the decision of Buckbeak's trial and appeal, not necessarily directly, but he has bought himself an influential at the Ministry and that may be enough to get his view given more weight than Hagrid's.
However even Arthur isn't immune from this, for example trying to get Mad-Eye out of serious trouble, and accepting several top quality World Cup tickets, seemingly in return for stopping Ludo's brother getting into trouble.
2) The focus is more on Trelawney’s prediction here than on Harry’s - but what do you think about his skills at Divination? Does he have a gift, or is it all coincidence?
I don't think we can tell from this example. Harry's prediction follows his own loyalties and although he happens to be right this time, he misses the fact the Buckbeak flew away with Sirius (and/or Harry and Hermione) on his back.
3) Of all the places Scabbers could turn up, why Hagrid’s hut? (What I mean is - why didn’t Pettigrew just flit off to find Voldemort when he faked his ratty death before?)
I think Peter was still hedging his bets at that point. He has decided that it is no longer safe to stay with Ron, but Hagrid's hut is near enough to stay in touch with what is happening, particularly as Hagrid is friends with the trio, but also a good place to escape from if circumstances require. It also seems that Hagrid's hut is off the edge of the Marauder's Map, as Lupin only spots Peter when the trio are returning to the castle.
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April 12, 2014, 03:53:39 PM
Reply #2

HealerOne

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3) Of all the places Scabbers could turn up, why Hagrid’s hut? (What I mean is - why didn’t Pettigrew just flit off to find Voldemort when he faked his ratty death before?)
I think Peter was still hedging his bets at that point. He has decided that it is no longer safe to stay with Ron, but Hagrid's hut is near enough to stay in touch with what is happening, particularly as Hagrid is friends with the trio, but also a good place to escape from if circumstances require. It also seems that Hagrid's hut is off the edge of the Marauder's Map, as Lupin only spots Peter when the trio are returning to the castle.
I wonder that Peter was again hedging his bets. He only returns to Voldemort when he knows that the Wizarding World (WW) will be told he is alive and an animagus. So until that 'cat is out of the bag', he wants the protection of being with other wizards so he can keep up with what is happening with his enemies and of course the enemies of Voldemort so that if he has to return to Voldy he will have something to bargain with. Also he knows Hagrid   :hagrid:  is a great friend of animals (and Harry), so he figures his cabin is a perfect place to hide and keep track of both Harry and what is going on in the WW. In addition, if Sirius is after him as he suspects - then DD and the Dementors are around to protect him from that threat.   
« Last Edit: April 12, 2014, 03:56:10 PM by HealerOne »
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May 02, 2014, 11:56:57 PM
Reply #3

paint it Black

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2) The focus is more on Trelawney’s prediction here than on Harry’s - but what do you think about his skills at Divination? Does he have a gift, or is it all coincidence?
I don't think we can tell from this example. Harry's prediction follows his own loyalties and although he happens to be right this time, he misses the fact the Buckbeak flew away with Sirius (and/or Harry and Hermione) on his back.
It does make one wonder if crystal-gazing is really all about just letting your mind be open to your thoughts, and if what Harry did in his exam was no more or less than any other crystal-gazer who succeeds in finding something within the ball.

.... Also he knows Hagrid   :hagrid:  is a great friend of animals (and Harry), so he figures his cabin is a perfect place to hide and keep track of both Harry and what is going on in the WW.  
True, although a rat might make a tasty snack for Buckbeak...  :-\

...In addition, if Sirius is after him as he suspects - then DD and the Dementors are around to protect him from that threat.   
Good point; I hadn't thought of that before.  :)

I thought it was interesting that Hagrid mentions that Beaky is getting depressed at being cooped up -- he must have gone crazy in OotP cooped up in Mrs. Black's bedroom in 12 GP.  Perhpas a bit of foreshadowing here.

I've always wondered something about the prophecies in HP: Why do the prophecies involving Voldemort refer to him as "Dark Lord"?  Does it have anything to do with the fact that he is known by two names (Voldemort and Tom Riddle), so perhaps "Dark Lord" refers to both of them?  If I remember correctly, the prophecy that Harry retrieves from the Ministry concerning his connection to Voldemort is also labeled "Dark Lord".  I recall that Harry once goads Snape about why he calls Voldemort "the Dark Lord" because, he says, he thought only death eaters called him that.  So ... where exactly do the vibrations that Sybill is picking up come from, and are they connected somehow to the mind of a death eater?   :hmm: Or is there some other explanation?

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May 03, 2014, 03:03:40 AM
Reply #4

HealerOne

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I've always wondered something about the prophecies in HP: Why do the prophecies involving Voldemort refer to him as "Dark Lord"?  Does it have anything to do with the fact that he is known by two names (Voldemort and Tom Riddle), so perhaps "Dark Lord" refers to both of them?  If I remember correctly, the prophecy that Harry retrieves from the Ministry concerning his connection to Voldemort is also labeled "Dark Lord".  I recall that Harry once goads Snape about why he calls Voldemort "the Dark Lord" because, he says, he thought only death eaters called him that.  So ... where exactly do the vibrations that Sybill is picking up come from, and are they connected somehow to the mind of a death eater?   :hmm: Or is there some other explanation?
I thought the reason the DE called Voldemort 'The Dark Lord' was because saying the name 'Voldemort' was a sign of disrespect. Similar to why Jews do not say the Holy name for God (YHWH or "Yehovah"). My guess is that at some point in Voldy's first reign of terror he outlawed anyone saying his name because he was so utterly convinced he was the best thing since sliced bread. He allowed the DE to say 'The Dark Lord' so as to give him another fancy tittle to make him feel good about himself. (My opinion only here ...) Eventually he figures out a spell that 'outs' anyone who does say his name (7th book).

I think Trelawny just has a vision/premonition of what is to come due to the momentous shift that is about to occur in the WW when Mr. Ratface gets hooked up with Moldy Voldy again. I wonder too, if messing with Time as Harry and Hermione do later that evening, has something to do with the unusual 'vibrations' that Sybil is feeling? 
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July 02, 2014, 05:15:54 PM
Reply #5

Evreka

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1) What does Buckbeak’s appeal process tell you about justice in the wizarding world? Are there any parallels with Harry’s legal troubles in book five?
Here it seems as if the wizarding world takes little interest in true justice when "lesser" beings lives are at stake. The person representing the committee is so old and withered maybe he'd need some younger co-worker who could travel to appeals and take, perhaps, more interest in seeing justice done?

On the whole, it seems to be Money and Influence that decide what is "right". Lucius threatened to Curse the Governors of Hogwarts, if they did not suspend Dumbledore last year, this year he decides Buckbeak's fate and in future years, he gets to decide even more fore Fudge!  :furious: After last year he is not a Governor anymore, but he has, if possible, even more say at the Ministry! That's kind of interesting… :hmm: How can he stay on as a Minister after such a threat as the one he made last year? Do English politicians get away with such things (obviously without magic)? (Ours wouldn't, I don't think.) Or is it just the Ministries at the MoM that can get away with it?


The wizarding world seems fairly corrupt. Lucius Malfoy is able to influence the decision of Buckbeak's trial and appeal, not necessarily directly, but he has bought himself an influential at the Ministry and that may be enough to get his view given more weight than Hagrid's.
They are also on uneven turf here, Lucius and Hagrid. Lucius is a well-educated, “aristocrat” of the wizarding world, who is also a Minister. It must be much easier for him to get the ears of other Ministers than for Hagrid. With less than two years at Hogwarts, and none of Lucius back-stabbing techniques, he has little chance.


However even Arthur isn't immune from this, for example trying to get Mad-Eye out of serious trouble, and accepting several top quality World Cup tickets, seemingly in return for stopping Ludo's brother getting into trouble.
That’s true… It suggests to me that the whole MoM works this way by default. If it were as dubious as I think it is, maybe Arthur wouldn’t do it?



2) The focus is more on Trelawney’s prediction here than on Harry’s - but what do you think about his skills at Divination? Does he have a gift, or is it all coincidence?
Harry doesn't see anything at all in the orb; it is all made up. So, no, he is no Seer. However, I find Trelawneys behaviour all the more "interesting", for want of a better word. One wonders how the exam Went for Parvati, who saw things and interpreted them (one must assume). Who did the interpretation then? Parvati or Trelawney, placing things in her mouth?  :mcgonagall2:

I've also always wondered what Sybil made of Harry's (made up) "Hippogriff sighting", the next day? Did he suddenly score full marks, because the hippogriff did fly off unharmed? Is she capable of admitting to be wrong?


I don't think we can tell from this example. Harry's prediction follows his own loyalties and although he happens to be right this time, he misses the fact the Buckbeak flew away with Sirius (and/or Harry and Hermione) on his back.
First off, we know that he faked it. But even if he had Seen Buckbeak flying off with someone riding him (in particular anyone who could be one of the trio) I don’t think Harry would ever have admitted it!



3) Of all the places Scabbers could turn up, why Hagrid’s hut? (What I mean is - why didn’t Pettigrew just flit off to find Voldemort when he faked his ratty death before?)
I think Sirius nails it a few chapters on: He was never eager to return to vapourmorth, especially not without first proven his true loyality (as a Dark one). It's not until after "tonight's" events that he is out of other options; it becomes the only place/person to which he can flee...


I think Peter was still hedging his bets at that point. …. It also seems that Hagrid's hut is off the edge of the Marauder's Map, as Lupin only spots Peter when the trio are returning to the castle.
Aah, yes! Great point about needing to stay outside of the Map’s reach! No wonder Scabbers got so anxious this year. Not only was Sirius at large and threatening him; so was Crookshanks. And to cap it all, Remus is back as well AND the Marauder’s Map is in the hands of Harry, who shares his dormitory! :o Ouch!



I've always wondered something about the prophecies in HP: Why do the prophecies involving Voldemort refer to him as "Dark Lord"?  Does it have anything to do with the fact that he is known by two names (Voldemort and Tom Riddle), so perhaps "Dark Lord" refers to both of them?  If I remember correctly, the prophecy that Harry retrieves from the Ministry concerning his connection to Voldemort is also labeled "Dark Lord".  I recall that Harry once goads Snape about why he calls Voldemort "the Dark Lord" because, he says, he thought only death eaters called him that.  So ... where exactly do the vibrations that Sybill is picking up come from, and are they connected somehow to the mind of a death eater?   :hmm: Or is there some other explanation?
That’s a very good question! :o Why indeed? I suppose, since the Prophecy mentions “the Dark Lord” that’s why it is labeled thus in the Hall of Prophecies, but why do Sibyl use that name? Could it be because that is the only direct name that people would recognize and be able to say? Few people would know who Tom Riddle was, Lord Voldemort isn’t a name people dare to say or even hear(!) and You-know-who isn’t a direct name… :hmm:  On the other hand, it could also be because she connects to some “over-wordly” knowledge that is entirely neutral (just reporting actual facts, even if these will come into play in the future), in which people are referred to as they themselves choose? :crabbegoyle:



I wonder too, if messing with Time as Harry and Hermione do later that evening, has something to do with the unusual 'vibrations' that Sybil is feeling? 
I doubt that: Hermione has messed with time all year long; and Trelawney’s first prediction wasn’t around the time anyone messed with time as far as we know. Further, the Hall of Prophecies is full of prophecies, if it took a Time-Turner to upset the world so these predictions could be made, I very much doubt that device would be so unusual given the amount of Prophecies.



I love the beginning of this chapter where we learn that even Fred and George had been spotted working(!) given their important OWL exam coming up! A nice bit of fore-shadowing on how important that exam must be! :fredgeorge:



At the same time we’re also told that Percy is looking for a career within the Ministry, and given the discussion on the corruption within it, I think his actions as Head Boy in Gryffindor Common Room as exam times loom nearer are quite interesting! >:( So, he thinks that if he needs to study, no one between 11-18 years of age could disrupt the quiet in the common room at night? Surely he is not supposed to give strong punishments to people who have fun in the Common Room? Isn’t the library the place to study if you want it calm around you? :mcgonagall2: Seems to me he’ll fit in beautifully at the MoM….  :annoyed:  :P



When I first read POA, I was convinced Hermione didn’t really follow several classes at once, but were allowed to get private tutoring later in the days on the duplicate classes instead, or something similar. Until I saw her exam schedule that is…  :mcgonagall2: Something is definitely fishy here….



Hermione’s Boggart is an interesting one: :owlsd: There’s two ways to look at it I think, the amusing side that Ron sees and then the realization of what it really means.  :console: it says a LOT about Hermione’s insecurities, that this is the worst possible scenario in her life! Awww….



Trelawney… :( Indeed very convenient that the students will have bad accidents if they tell about the test…   :mcgonagall2: Right… Not even the fact that Ron (who comments on it) does have an “accident” breaking his foot later tonight, have me very convinced about this…

Best confession ever, from this fraud of a teacher: I would certainly not presume to predict anything as far-fetched as that! Yeah, right….

Sad, in a way, that her true predictions are the ones she will refute ever making….

« Last Edit: July 02, 2014, 05:22:59 PM by Evreka »
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